Comments for Drama on the Dolphin Coast: Mocke Brothers take Day 1 at http://www.surfski.info , comment 0 to 20 out of 34 comments http://www.surfski.info Sat, 06 Sep 2008 12:24:40 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.2 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1676 We did the race this year and, as far as I know (and the results suggest), were the last boat to get out... took about 45min. Loved every minute of it! What I'm keen to know is what difference from a safety perspective a wet start would have made? As others have mentioned, there was no mass charge to get out; most of the field took their time. Whatever happens, you still need to face the surf and, given the difficulty and would-be enforced time limit, I'm guessing everyone would've tried to get out asap so the congestion would've been the same. The only difference being that once out you'd now have to contend with remaining stationary behind backline in a howling wind. A wet start may make sense from a racing perspective but not for safety... if anything, it could've proven more difficult. As far as a poll goes, I think its pretty clear from all the comments that the vast majority that did the race loved it. Thanks to the organisers for a cracker and will def be back next year! - Guy Balme Sat, 03 Nov 2007 16:21:04 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1671 The old adage that you cannot please everyone has been proven over and over again. There are more than enough races for paddlers of every level, particularly at an entry level. Why water down the sport by making long standing, traditional, testing events "easy" for everyone... If we take the challenges out of the sport what incentive is their for newcomers we welcome to the sport to work on their all round SURFski skills, to be able to take on these challenges, whether the challenge be big downwind, or big surf. To use other sports as an analogy... I know a lot of people who surf, but wouldnt paddle out at a firing Pipeline or Teahupoo... (but wish they could, and appreciate the opportunity to watch the worlds best take it on). I know a lot of people who run, but couldn't take on the 89km Comrades Ultra... (but wish they could, and appreciate the opportunity to train and aspire to be a finisher). Every year canoeists flock to one of the country's biggest river races... the Fish... some break their boats on day one, smile and try again the next year. Why is this race so popular?? Could it be the challenge it presents? Let those who have taken on and finished epic races like the PE-EL, Dolphin Coast, Cape Point, Molokai etc. continue to walk tall knowing they have been there and done it... and don't deny those who haven't YET, the opportunity to aspire... - Mark Thu, 01 Nov 2007 23:12:42 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1670 As a CT paddle that travelled up to do the race and couldn't get out on day 1 I find it absurd that there is this debate about the conditions. Daryl is spot on when he says that competitors know exactly what to expect when they enter the race. It is exactly what drives most paddlers to compete in this particular race. Further I did not hear any comments from the CT guys that if they had known that the conditions were going to be as they were they would then not have travelled to Durban. The race is a challenge that all the guys wanted to take on. There seems to be this concept that everything must be aimed at the growth of the sport, and obviously everyone wants to see surfski grow, but there also need to be events that provide challenges for those that want to take them on. The Dolphin Coast Challenge is such an event. To complain that there was big surf at the Dolphin Coast Challenge is akin to arriving at PE-EL and complaining that 244km is too far to paddle. - Peter Jones Thu, 01 Nov 2007 21:12:26 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1669 I found the comments on the Dolphin Coast quite amusing. The Dolphin Coast was my first surfski race ever. From my experience, I hope that all surfski races are like the Dolphin Coast. Surely all Natal races take place in surf like that? Anyway, I'm now hooked on surfskiing - the runs on day 1 were superb and day 2 was some fantastic coastline. Surely there's no fun in doing surfskiing in flat conditions - bit like the berg I would have thought? - Shaun Thu, 01 Nov 2007 17:58:55 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1668 Just like everything in life, there are always two sides to the story and not everyone was pleased with the carnage on Day 1. We've heard strong opinions from the guys in favour of retaining the format, "that's the way the Dolphin Coast is" but we haven't heard from guys who broke equipment. I have spoken to people who were there and who weren't happy with the surf conditions. Not everyone was happy guys, that's a fact. I agree with Daryl, perhaps a questionnaire to all the people who entered the race would give an accurate reflection of what people think. If everyone says, "that's the way we want it, that's fine" then we'll know. At the moment the guys with the strongest feelings on the subject are being heard but there may be other opinions! - Rob Mousley Thu, 01 Nov 2007 17:46:50 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1666 Well said Daryl Guys travel to this race to take on the challenge knowing exactly what its all about. There was a crew from PE, EL, Joberg and Cape Town all looking to take on the conditions. What most people don't realise (you would if you were there) that there was only one complaining at the race about the start. All the rest were there to do the Dolphin Coast! Thanks to all those who traveled to do the race, i have no doubt you enjoyed the challenge! - Barry Lewin Thu, 01 Nov 2007 16:50:25 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1665 Rob, please could you try get some info together from the race and post a poll on: 1. How many boats were damaged? 2. How many of them damaged by other skis? 3. How many people just couldn't make it out? 4. How many people enjoyed the race with it's current format and will be back? Never before have I heard so much moaning about the call to start from the beach. Most of it coming from guys who weren't actually at the race! All these guys that want wet starts....I'm assuming they will want wet finishes too...I mean coming through the surf is also dangerous and Heaven forbid you take a swim or damage your ski after paddling 2.5hrs. Last year's Dolpnin Coast I swam for 4 mins after trying to beat Herman to the shore and get the race record....in average size surf. Doplhin Caost has been host to National titles, whether it be singles or doubles, for many years now because on any one day it can test every aspect of paddling in the ocean. Every year there are a group of ski paddlers that travel all the way up to Durbs from CT and E-Cape. They do so well knowing what conditions they may be faced with come race day. One just has to look at the pictures on the website of 6foot shorey's at Salt Rock to Zinkwazi firing a solid 10ft backline. The races like Dolphin Caost, Cape Point and PE-EL aren't there to grow the sport but rather give aspiring paddlers something to aim for. These races aren't there for the 'numbers' and will seldom attract huge fields because of the skill and endurance needed. Same happens in River races...the conditions come race day might be totally different to what the organisers ahd planned and what might have been a medium level river now becomes a low level rock-hop bonanza. The National Championship title awarded to the race is done so months before. If we wanted ideal conditions for every championship, we'd take up indoor swimming. Cheers DB - Daryl Bartho Thu, 01 Nov 2007 10:49:44 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1663 What does it take for the chap running this race & the National Championships to come forward and justify the call on the day. Was it run like this as the SA Champs got 'lumped' into the Dolphin Coast Challenge....when if I am right.... a year ago, the guys went 'flat' in Knysna.....and then surfed to Segfield? Are the champs just random 'conditions as you find them', or is it planned this way ie River guys might win in Cape - but S Lifesaving boys will win in Durban? For me the lack of forthright official debate & reason is the real issue. If we want to sport to grow....I do not know that you ask a chap to drive 2000km (CT -Durbs) and have him smashed in 5 min, or get not 1 female team into the 'race'. Challenge & race they are different.....and a National Title, is a National Title. - Gavin Dickinson Wed, 31 Oct 2007 17:22:54 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1662 Guys, or should I say "Oaks" - Still not sure what calling a dude a tree means but anyway here it goes... The Big O like it or not is not only a long time SA Champ and ambassador but also as you know a current "World Champ" and I would think he is owed a bit more respect, but I get you guys and how it goes over there and personally I really dig SA and hang well with the majority of your countrymen who make it over here. I especially like the mass consumption of Beer that goes on when the boys are in town! Hahhhh. O's speaks from what I can tell for the majority of ski paddlers around the world who are getting into this sport but may not have the huge shorebreak type of surf that you guys have, but have open ocean down hill big wind type of conditions. As for Hawaii and that matter Tahiti you all know of our legendary surf but lets get serious here. No one would ever take a ski out through a Big North shore break and make it out in one piece.. It just doesn't happen.. I grew up surfing on the North shore and have a house on the beach at Laniakea, near Waimea and Pipeline and belive me in big surf you would never make it much less race it... Ask Lewis about Tahiti and see if anyone would get out at Chopo on a big day... My point is in Hawaii we don't have this argument because quite simply the concept of ski racing over here is about who is the best "Paddler" in the ocean on a particular day and not about who got lucky and timed it right getting out of the lineup. We also respect our eqipement enough that all our races either start in Channels or beyond the backline given the costs of new skis these days. I will go one step more and say that those that enjoy the out through the surf thing should maybe continue with the lifeguard thing as thats what I here they do in OZ. If we want to continue growing this sport this one aspect needs to be addressed once and for all as quite simply how can you exspect racers to spend big bucks and time to travel to a competition and have the race end and the possiblity of your $3k ski broken in half in the first minutes of a long race.... That being said I respect your history with the Challenges as I did the old Dolphin two day (Slinky?) race with Hank's Dad and Malcom H. years ago in small to medium surf and remember running second or third behind Lee and O until one of the mandatory run up the beach dragging your ski and then get slammed in the shorebreak whatching my beautiful new carbon Chalupsky(Given to me by DSLS) get slammed back to the beach and guess what? I finished nearly last as my ski separated on the rails and I took in water for the next 2 hours or so, so much so that I barely made it to the finish with out sinking!! Ask me if I would spend big money to come and do that race again? Yah right! Same thing goes for Perth for that matter... I will not travel and do a big race that does not start in the Ocean on your ski drink tube in mouth!! Hahhhhh there it is - Oh well... I guess that leaves only Molokai. See you Oaks next May! Aloha, Mark - Mark Sandvold Wed, 31 Oct 2007 09:06:53 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1655 Jasper Pons posted this video clip on youtube, showing the guys coming in at Zinkwazi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W_QY7qNRQ4 - Rob Mousley Tue, 30 Oct 2007 08:44:50 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1654 "The ARB world cup was a prime example why it should be kept in play. Those that are good enough to get through the surf zone will be good enough to handle the conditions." If you're saying that paddlers are only competent if they can get through surf, then I disagree completely! I am barely competent in the surf, yet more than competent in big water beyond the break. We do many downwind runs every year in big confused seas here in Cape Town and I had a ball at the ARB World Cup - probably the most fun downwind run I've ever had. I'd find it totally unacceptable to be barred from a race like the ARB World Cup because I don't get to practise in surf down here in Cape Town! The skill required to go out through surf has very little to do with the skill required to paddle in big waves beyond the break (in my opinion)! Racing through the surf ======================= However, it seems to me that the majority of people (in Durban at any rate) want to retain some races that have the challenge of going out through the surf. That's fine, but the big picture is growth of the sport worldwide and there are very few places overseas where surf is part of the game (with the exception of Australia and I'm not sure that even they often launch long distance races through the surf, it would be interesting to know). So by all means, retain the surf for some races, but if you want to grow the sport and include overseas competitors, then reduce the surf factor for the mainstream races, like the ARB World Cup where the start is beyond the back line. Dolphin Coast 2007 ================== The Dolphin Coast is a classic South African race that has been around a long time. Everyone knows that the surf is part of the challenge so it's difficult to justify a call to change the format - especially as it seems that most of the people who took part don't want it changed! (It would be interesting perhaps to take a poll of those whose boats were broken.) Having said all that there are two issues to debate: - The first is safety. There must surely be a limit somewhere - and from the sound of it, conditions on Day 1 were arguably beyond the limit. Example: Simon Blackburn - extremely experienced paddler - said he had the closest of calls. They'd been smashed sideways in the surf when another ski behind them punched through - the bow of the oncoming ski just missed Simon's head and grazed the back of his neck. He and his brother spent the next while helping to rescue people before finally setting off again an hour and a half after the start. I'm not sure how many skis were broken, but it was a significant proportion of the fleet. - The second is whether such an extreme race should be used as a championship race. Most of the comments I've heard or read about this race mention "luck" being required at the Day 1 start. Should a championship include such a large element of luck? Some suggestions that I've heard include: - Not starting the race on the point of low tide (the race started at 10h00; low tide was at 10h30). I've heard the opinion expressed by people who were there that if the race had started two hours earlier, the waves would have been easier to read and while it would have required just as much skill to get out, less luck would have been involved. - Perhaps for those guys not wanting to start through the surf, they could opt for a ten minute handicap and go through the surf in their own time and start beyond the break. - Rob Mousley Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:57:29 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1653 For my 5 cents worth i think that we should differentiate between the two.For races all must be equal ie a back line start with no crashing through waves etc.for challenges it can be a no rules barred type of event.I dont believe that national titles should be decided on challenges. And whilst on the subject of challenges are we going to keep the Cape point a challenge or are we going to cheapen it by having a paddle to to the ponit all in False Bay as we did 2 years ago.This really cheapens the challenge and irritates the paddlers who have met the challenge paddling 30 kms into the wind then had to paddle a kilometer out to sea to get round the point. What about the 5/6 paddlers that finished the 3rd challenge due to the shocking conditions ask them what they feel about the changing of courses. - PARKSY Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:44:43 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1652 Well we did the dolphin coast challange. Yes we were near the tail of the successful ones to get out on saturday. We saw the surf and my partner and I stood on the beach and sussed out the conditions and waves. we decided on our lines. We were one of the first boats out.No punching waves no spills and were very surprised to see some of the top guys only come past later in the race. We were not lucky we just read the conditions well. I think it is sour grapes when the waves take out the big boys dents the ego a bit. But it is part of the game. The rush of the race and getting through the surf is part of the game. This is not a canoe race. I will not forget what one of the baalies said at the legends evening in durban about the scottbrugh to brighton. The sole reason for coming in at toti was so that the surfski guys and life saving guys would be able to use their knowledge to best advantage through the surf so the canoeing guys could not win. Maybe a lesson should be taken from these legends. Wonder what they would have to say about all the whinging about the surf. Seems like they dont make the legends the way they used to. I think you want to surfski albeit long distance. keep the surf in play. The ARB world cup was a prime example why it should be kept in play. Those that are good enough to get through the surf zone will be good enough to handle the conditions. The surf at toti was mild on arb race day and I think to easy for some of the guys to get out that maybe should not have been out. Yes we did finish that race as well near the bottom of the pack. - Boerbokrib Mon, 29 Oct 2007 20:53:07 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1649 I was one of the Capies who didn't make it out on day one. i wouldn't have gone all the way up there if it wasn't going to be a challenge (even though getting out on a single on day one seemed to be a lotto)....Made me feel better watching some of the"pros" coming unstuck though. Anyway thanks for a great event, will be back next time. - RB Mon, 29 Oct 2007 17:28:15 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1648 I just re read my comment & want to state for clarity that not for 1 moment am I calling the Mocke victory 'luck'. They won from behind on day 2 and deserve the title 100%. My comments are big picture & long term... I also think that somee of the guys baiting the World Champ here (fun to read though, and our sport is action & fun) should be fair..and ask themselves how many Molo's, PE/EL's, World Titles they are going to win in a life time. - Gavin Dickinson Mon, 29 Oct 2007 16:10:34 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1646 Great fun boys... and well done to the CT lads...but you have to ask if in a SA Doubles Champs (or any other race where a 'National' title is being awarded the following observation from Jasper on surfski.co,za... 'Personally i saw two ski's snap and in 15 minutes i only saw 3 guys get out' about the singles start...makes in big surf starts, the title bit of a lottery. I do not want to see the surf taken out...but do say that if a top contender gets clubbed in the 1st 5min on a 2hr race (and is thus really 'out') it is not great for the race, nor is it good for the sport to have loads of skis trashed on the beach. Possibly we should start a new series, where bigger stronger skis are used (set min weight) and the surf kings of SA ski racing can be crowned. Great spectator sport....reminds me of cricket, with limited overs, 20/20, super sixes, beach champs...all extending the 'reach' of the game. I know...'surf kings' is a Surf Life Saving SA Champs event already...but you get my drift. - Gavin Dickinson Mon, 29 Oct 2007 12:17:00 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1643 Well done Daaf and Jasp, you guys had an awesome race - also reaaly good to see the respect offered by the Bartho boys . My take on the surf issue is that we have more than enough races around the world where the isnt really any big surf. You have to remember that some of these surf start races have been around for a long time - PE-EL etc - the surf zone is what makes the race a challenge. It becomes part of why those races are respected - because they offer all the dynamics in order to test the skills required. But in saying that I truly believe there is only one race in the world that offers all facets of surfski paddling in order to test the best - THE CAPE POINT CHALLENGE - this race is also started in a protected bay - no issues of losing your boat - what it does bring is a guarentee of complete varied conditions - upwind - side chop and downwind conditions , this race then offers all the elements to test the paddlers - and I believe without any doubt - this race should be used as the World Cup of World Cup's. If you only have downwind races - how do we know how good the guys are in going into the wind etc. So lets get all the top dogs,local and International to CT on the 22 Dec - and have a proper honest race - without any issues - no harbour - no ships - no excuses about big surf at the start . See you all on the start line !! Traut - Trautmann Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:31:50 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1642 Amazing that the only congrats going out to Dawid and Japs are from the crew they narrowly beat this weekend and from Mark Beck .. let's hope those egos recover in time for the Cape Point! Somebody should warn the Big O about the gnarly reefs off the Cape Point Reserve too! Oh wait no, he's got a GPS...let him find them himself. HaHa! Well done Darryl and Brett too for the humility shown and a world class paddling effort too ... - Graeme Trautmann Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:24:39 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1640 Good morning guys. Woke upi this morning feeling a bit tender, but totally satisfied, with another Men'sHealth Dolphin Coast under the belt. Reading everyone's comments you can clearly see 2 sides to this argument. There are definately some people who would prefer to start at backline, not having the butterflies in teh stomach before the start...nervous discussions with your partner on best place to line up etc. In big surf conditions like we had on Saturday, the decision was made that it would be a dry-start.....EQUAL for everyone. You could chose your line within the start markers and the rest was up to your skill and a bit of luck. The debate continues with this whole story about lightweight skis vs the power of the ocean...... One thing I can't get my head around is why some people are complaining. You do not arrive at the start of the Umkomaas or any big river for that matter with a craft that is not suitable for those conditions. You don't see super lightweight kayaks at the start of Umko....9 times out of 10 you'll see the top paddlers in stock standard glass boats....why, because they know what to expect. Another thing you don't hear about after races like the Umko is people whining that the river was too big or conditions too tough. Granted, safety must remain a high priority, but guys let's not take the challenge out of our 'Challenges' please. Generally the guys that arrive at the start line with the new breed of lightweight ski are sponsored athletes or guys who don't mind spending the extra dollar on these boats. Surely they should then be able to make the decision beforehand whether or not their choice of ski is correct for the surf conditions. It could be a plan to have a stock standard ski for these conditions...just a suggestion. Brett & I both sat at the start with the thought of our brand new ski being damaged running through our minds. Keith had slaved away to get our ski to us on time, only having picked it up on the fri morning, we were not keen to have it smashed by the surf or some other ski. BUT, this added to the challenge of the race! Anyway, enough from me. Let's face it guys, there are so many races out there that cater for EVERYONE nowadays. Let's not spoil the few Challenges we have left and keep things simple.... DB - Daryl Bartho Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:14:55 +0100 http://www.surfski.info/content/view/547/147/#pc_1639 For someone who is not an Elite paddler, to turn up at an event and see pounding surf send shivers down my spine for 2 reasons. Firstly, the exitement of will I won't I get out? Secondly, am I about to risk a ski which cost a fair bit of money and alot of household chores to get past the wife? I have seen it on many occasion when guys rock up with there prized carbon V10 or Mako6 only to be putting it back on the roof in two trips. Yes a start through the surf is what the sport is about but I for one believe the benefits are outweighed by the risk to equipment and competitors. If you have 50 guys all trying to get through the surf at the same time, you will loose say 10%. These 5 skis now turn sideways and proceed to hurtle towards other paddlers bringing up the rear. On more than one occasion I have seen people knocked out by runaway skis. Being unconcious in the surf zone is not a healthy situation, made worse when your not wearing a PFD. When the surf gets as big as the images in Rob's report, no matter how good at beach starts you are because if one of those waves unloads on your ski you'll be swimming. However, a very good point made by Dawid that you could have guys waiting for 30mins plus in the howling wind kind of negates all of the above. Tough one. - Ben Hines Mon, 29 Oct 2007 03:21:58 +0100