Leaning to stear the ski

1 month 2 weeks ago #36660 by AndersKristiansen
Hi.
Something i have been working on lately but have not quite figured out.
I sometimes hear people say that leaning the ski to the right makes it turn right and vice versa. In practice, going downwind, bracing, to the right, leaning to the right and steering the rudder to the right usually go hand in hand.
But when I try to not use the rudder and just stear by leaning and bracing, i have to use the paddle almost as a brake to stear the ski, slowing it down (which was what i tried to avoid by not using the rudder). 
I do feel some effect of leaning/bracing when I do use the rudder.  But this is more like a combination of balance/gravity and the fact that the waterline gets shorter when I lean. I cannot feel any "carving" effect of just leaning the ski.
I paddle a Fenn Elite Glide, and I suspect that the shape of the ski has something to do with my lack of success. I am totally stable in the ski and the leaning is no problem. But can the long waterline and narrow beam reduce the effect of the leaning? The Glide is known to have little rocker, although I feel the lack of rocker in this ski is exagerated. Maybe it has something to do with it superseding sth Elite /SL which was quite heavily rockered.
So I don't feel like blaming the ski.
Am i missing something or did I just have to high expectations on the effect of leaning?

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1 month 2 weeks ago #36670 by mrcharly
Replied by mrcharly on topic Leaning to stear the ski
Skinny boats with no rocker are hardly affected by leaning to turn. It just doesn't have much effect on the hull shape.

Some boats turn faster when leaned to the outside of the turn. Some, with extreme rocker, turn faster with an inside lean. 
It is subtle, you'll need to experiment on glass-smooth water to see if it is helping. 
I've found that modifying the standard wing stroke to make it into a 'short sweep' outwards has more effect; sort of a combination of a sweep and pry. Just angle the blade out a bit more, pull hard and out.
See this video for a superb example. Watch the guy in the black and yellow top, from 3:52

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1 month 2 weeks ago #36673 by waverider
Replied by waverider on topic Leaning to stear the ski
I kinda do that on my k1, on sharp river turnabouts. Though a lot of it has to with it putting more weight on your outer blade and the "sweep" is directing more force in the direction you want to. For gentle course corrections then the extra weight on the outer blade is sufficient. Dont like "actively" turning a k1 rudder unless necessary. 

Ski rudders are so responsive that it is more effective using that than altering your stoke. When surfing then leaning in and bracing to turn is effective. You can only lean towards the side of the brace, whether it is a skim brace on the inside of the turn or the sweep/power stoke on the outside of the turn

My rudderless touring boat with a flat blade i edge it onto the outside, which changes wetted hull profile. Combine this with a keyhole stroke which is a combination of J stroke and rear draw at the end, this slides the tail around which is possible without a rudder, more effective than a sweep. For slower tight turns I insert a pause on the inner catch, which is in effect a bow rudder to start the turn

Carving by leaning to the inside on a boat without rocker like a ski is mainly down the face of a wave, Its just adding more wetted surface (resistance) to one side
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1 month 2 weeks ago #36684 by AndersKristiansen
Thank you for your comments. 
I guess they correspond well with my own experience. I also use the "lean right, sweep right, turn left" in tight turns on flatwater, but probably had a bit to high expectations to the lean, and brace right, going downwind.

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1 month 2 weeks ago #36695 by feeny
Replied by feeny on topic Leaning to stear the ski
On a run for small adjustments I try keep the rudder centred and weight shift. Hard to remember when not in the boat but I'm pretty sure that when I drop the right (butt) cheek, the boat steers left. It's a great sensation too, the good old butt-steer off one run dropping right into another, with not a stroke taken.

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