Does a wing paddle surface area include the leading edge lip?

8 months 2 weeks ago #37622 by MCImes
Maybe one of the OEM's or knowledgeable among you knows - does the stated surface area of a blade only include the 2 dimensional "shadow" profile of the blade, or does it take into account the airfoil lip (i.e. a 3 dimensional surface area that accounts for the part of the blade that is perpendicular to the blade?

I see most blade dimensions stated in a simple X by Y dimensions, but really there is surface area in XYZ plane with the airfoil shape of the blade.

I understand this may vary from brand to brand, but I would think they follow some sort of similar standard when measuring.

Currently paddling a Kai Wa'a Vega Flex in Southern California's ocean waters
Past Boats: Epic V10g1, Stellar SRg1, Fenn XTg1, Swordfish S
"When you've done something right, they wont know you've done anything at all"

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8 months 2 weeks ago #37625 by leolinha
I have a Think Powerwing paddle that has a stated area of only 655 cm2, the smallest blade area I know of.
As a comparison, the smallest Epic wing paddle (small mid wing) has a nominal area of 735 cm2.
But the Powerwing, although small, has a very large "airfoil lip", deeper than any other paddle I've ever seen. For this reason, I doubt that the nominal surface area takes into account the entire area of this internal curve.
So I think that the nominal surface area of a blade is, in fact, the area of its shadow profile, as you mentioned.

Current: Epic V8 PRO, Think Evo 3
Past: Epic V8, Epic V10 Sport

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8 months 2 weeks ago #37631 by waverider
I have a generic wing paddle which is on the small sized. No idea of what size it is supposed to be. Any idea of any easy way to measure as a comparison?

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8 months 2 weeks ago #37646 by leolinha

waverider wrote: I have a generic wing paddle which is on the small sized. No idea of what size it is supposed to be. Any idea of any easy way to measure as a comparison?


There is no easy way to measure the area of such an irregular shape as a wing blade, even if only its projection (shadow) is what we are talking about. I bet that the manufacturers "measure" it with the computer program used to design it, then never again!

Current: Epic V8 PRO, Think Evo 3
Past: Epic V8, Epic V10 Sport

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8 months 2 weeks ago - 8 months 2 weeks ago #37648 by LaPerouseBay

leolinha wrote:

waverider wrote: I have a generic wing paddle which is on the small sized. No idea of what size it is supposed to be. Any idea of any easy way to measure as a comparison?


There is no easy way to measure the area of such an irregular shape as a wing blade, even if only its projection (shadow) is what we are talking about. I bet that the manufacturers "measure" it with the computer program used to design it, then never again!


Ha ha, it's actually pretty basic stuff these days.  Here's a free trial.   
www.sketchandcalc.com/

Epic mid is advertised as 750, Odin at 765.  That agrees with my eyeball calculation.  The Odin has a more  forgiving catch and release, so I can run the shaft longer.  Great blade.  Highly recommended for downwinding.  Very light.

I may try to scale photos of each on Autocad.  But, IMO, it's the shape that matters - more than the area.  Where's 'Kayakchampeen" when you need him?  That guy knew blade shapes!  Sad I missed his exit from the forum, he was a whiz.     

downwind dilettante

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8 months 2 weeks ago #37649 by mrcharly
Blade shape is very important, as LaPerouseBay said.

I tried lots of paddles before buying my jantex - it has a really hard catch and I consequently ordered a smaller blade. Glad I did. 

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8 months 3 days ago - 8 months 3 days ago #37746 by Atlas
I miss Kayakchampeen too. A loose cannon alright. You sure didn't want to be in his crosshairs but damn; he knew about paddles! And plenty more about hydrodynamics.

Current skis:
Epic V9 Ultra, Epic V10L Ultra, Carbonology Sport Boost LV, Carbonology Sport Boost LV X, Fenn Bluefin, Nelo 510, Fenn XT double

Previous skis
Spirit PRS, Fenn Swordfish, Fenn XT, Fenn Swordfish S, Think Zen, Epic V10L Club

Most with DK rudders.

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8 months 3 days ago #37747 by waverider

waverider wrote: I have a generic wing paddle which is on the small sized. No idea of what size it is supposed to be. Any idea of any easy way to measure as a comparison?


i put it up against a braca iv 735 and it seems just a bit smaller . The curve was definitely substantially shallower....Dont know just how much difference a paddle up grade will make but I guess its getting time to put one on the shopping list soon.

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7 months 2 weeks ago #37785 by SpaceSputnik
I suspect it's not just the flat shadow that gets measured. Some of my kayaker friends use high angle euro paddles that look like large pancakes compared to my small Epic, yet their surface is well below 700 cm2 even for large blades. My customized 720 cm2 Epic mid doesn't look that large in comparison. But it's just a casual observation.

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