Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport

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7 years 4 weeks ago #24049 by MaxB
I'm a fast intermediate level paddler in easy conditions, but I drop way back in bigger conditions due to my poor balance and low confidence. I'm considering a more stable boat to help me develop my open water skills, and am looking at the options in I guess what might be considered the "lower intermediate" category - something around 48cm wide. The new Epic V10 Sport and the new 2015 Stellar SR are a couple of boats on my radar. Can anyone compare and contrast these two, or offer any other suggestions or input?
Thanks in advance! Max.

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7 years 4 weeks ago #24050 by portmanm
Other options to consider

- Stellar SEI
- Think Evo II
- Fenn Swordfish
- Vajda Hawx 46 (at a stretch maybe)

Bio
- 90kg, 183cm, paddling 90+% in ocean conditions for 5 years. Prefer downwind.
- Epic V12 1G, V10 1G/2G, V10 Sport, V8 & V8 Pro
- Stellar SEI 1G/2G, SES 1G/2G, SEL 2G, SR 2G & S2E
- Vadja Hawx 43/46/52
- Think Evo II 2G, Ion 1G
- Fenn Elite S, Swordfish S
- Nelo 560M

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7 years 4 weeks ago - 7 years 4 weeks ago #24051 by barrypaddle1
If your heavier around 95kgs plus you could consider the V10 Sport or the EVO 2 as these are larger volume skis.

If your in the 75ish to 95kgs then the SEI, SR and swordfish will be more suited and less corky as they sit lower in the water.

Width is not everything for stability!

The swordfish tends to bury the nose in open water and is a lot wetter then the others. Some people complain of dead leg syndrome paddling Fenns.

When i've paddled mates SEI i've found it to be the best all round and comfortable ski I have paddled.

No idea about the Vadja but assume resale could be an issue.
Last edit: 7 years 4 weeks ago by barrypaddle1.

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7 years 3 weeks ago - 7 years 3 weeks ago #24053 by Simon Haywood
Max B here is a link to a thread started a year ago: www.surfski.info/forum/19-boats/18028-st...sei-vs-v10sport.html

And the new model SR (series 2) is better again!

Previous craft: Affinity, Endorfinn, Multisport, Epic V8, V10sport, V10, V12, Fenn Swordfish, Spirit PRS Elite; Stellar S18S, SR, SE, SEL, S2E, S2EL

Current Skis:
Huki S1-R
Stellar S18S - Excel
Stellar SR - Ultra


Skis on order: None!
Last edit: 7 years 3 weeks ago by Simon Haywood. Reason: additional info

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24076 by red_pepper
Definitely give the new SR a try. I had a chance to play with the 2015 SR a few weeks ago and came away extremely impressed. In the 1st gen version I loved the hull design and construction, but I wasn't all that fond of the cockpit fit, the width of the cockpit, and the slower drainage. The new cockpit is dramatically better and feels superb - one of the best I've tried. Stellar moved the cockpit a little further forward, narrowed the sides for a closer paddle catch, reduced the cockpit volume, installed two bailers (which work very well) and created an excellent ski in the process. Lots of stability, but in a fun, fast, very solid package you can really enjoy. I have an SEI, but from what you described as your reason to buy a new ski I think you would prefer the SR for the extra stability.

I've paddled the 1st gen V10S and liked it, but I haven't had a chance to paddle the 2nd gen so I can't comment on it. I would love to try one sometime. But I do know someone who has both and really loves the SR for the extra stability.

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24089 by TaffyMick
Having owned and paddled an older SR, a Swordfish, a 2nd Gen Epic V10S an SEI and now a 2015 SR in Excel layup I can unequivocally state in this forum that the new Stellar SR is the best ski of the lot of them...for me.

The design improvements in the 2015 SR cannot be understated. They work and they bloody work well in all conditions. Being ex Rugby Union front row I am a big unit whose weight ranges from 108 to 118kg. The new SR has no problem with this weight and I have held 12.3kph for over 200 metres in dead flat water.

Offshore it us much improved in its ability to pick up runs much easier than the previous model due to the seat being moved forward, less volume in the bucket and a much more narrower catch.

The other thing, get it set up right and it feels as though you are comfortably "locked in" in the seating and leg position with your calves just touching the sides. Does wonders for stability, though in saying that the new SR is definitely more tippier than the previous model and more twitchy than the V10S. Those dual venturis combined with the less volume work a treat.

Anyway, that's my two bob's worth on the subject.

Mick

Stellar SEI, Fenn Bluefin S, Sladecraft Comet Long Rec & Vajda K1

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24090 by Dicko
Replied by Dicko on topic Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport
Taffy,
I have a mate who has a similar boat history to yourself. In fact he has had many, many boats. He bought a custom kayaks zeplin and without a doubt it is the best boat he has owned. If you ever get the chance, put your bum in one and see how you go.

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24093 by Gaz
Replied by Gaz on topic Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport
Mick, I noticed you have a Sladecraft Comet in your fleet. Can I ask how the stability of the Comet compares to the SEI and Swordfish ?

I have paddled a Comet for quite a few years and wonder if it is much of a step up to an intermediate ski or should I make my first foray into ski paddling in a more forgiving ski such as an SR maybe ?

I usually paddle the Comet in fairly benign conditions and use a sea kayak on open water. I am looking at selling the sea kayaks and getting into a ski. Your feedback would be appreciated.

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24097 by kobicohen33
Hi.
I started with 115 kilos on the V8, I continued to paddle on epic v10 Sport and now I am 94 kg...

So without a doubt = Epic V10 sport ( Elite\ultra\per)

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7 years 3 weeks ago - 7 years 2 weeks ago #24098 by TaffyMick

Gaz wrote: Mick, I noticed you have a Sladecraft Comet in your fleet. Can I ask how the stability of the Comet compares to the SEI and Swordfish ?

I have paddled a Comet for quite a few years and wonder if it is much of a step up to an intermediate ski or should I make my first foray into ski paddling in a more forgiving ski such as an SR maybe ?

I usually paddle the Comet in fairly benign conditions and use a sea kayak on open water. I am looking at selling the sea kayaks and getting into a ski. Your feedback would be appreciated.


Hi Gaz,

The reason I bought a used Sladecraft Comet was for competing in this year's PaddleNSW Marathon Series. I have only finally finished setting it up today with a Bumfortable seat and adjusted the footplate and pedals to suit my paddling technique. Completed my ranking race in Canberra on a ski and had a DNF on the Hawkesbury in the second race due to continual weed build up on the rudder of my boat (idiot that I am, I used my surf rudder :blush: ).

To answer your question, the Comet is much more stable than a Swordfish, SEI and the 2015 SR for that matter. Be aware that the 2015 SR is now probably more aligned to an intermediate boat compared to the previous model which I classed as a high end beginner boat, similar to a Fenn XT. This is fully evident paddling it offshore and chasing runners. See Simon's Videos on this forum. It is also more twitchier and tippier than the previous model. Something that Wes Echols on his Surfski Blog also concurs. www.surfskiracing.org/

However, both of the Stellars have something the Comet does not have and that is excellent secondary stability. Put the Comet, with the pronounced V shaped chine and sharp edge at the tip point and you don't stay upright for long (as you would be fully aware of).

Be that as it may, you won't go wrong with the Stellar SR. The SEI or Swordfish will probably be too much of an initial jump and will cause you no end of grief and frustration. Learned that lesson the hard (and expensive) way.

Notice that you live in Sydney, I am in Wollongong. If you are down this way you are quite welcome to try my SR out. Ross Crawshaw at Paddlecraft on Pittwater Road at Bayview on the Northern Beaches has demo SRs, SEIs and Swordies. Give him a call and arrange a test paddle. He and his partner Helen are great people and would only be too willing to help you out.

Hope this helps :)

Cheers,
Mick

Stellar SEI, Fenn Bluefin S, Sladecraft Comet Long Rec & Vajda K1
Last edit: 7 years 2 weeks ago by TaffyMick.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Gaz

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24099 by Gaz
Replied by Gaz on topic Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport
Thanks for the quick reply Mick and the generous offer. Good to get the input from someone who has not only paddled the same boat as me but also the boats I am considering.

I am fortunate to have a local kayak shop (Emu Plains, would you believe !) who is carrying the range of Stellar skis. They have offered me a test paddle of the SEI and SR whenever I'm ready.

For some reason, the few swims I've had while paddling the Comet have been mid winter on the Nepean River. Not much fun swimming to shore in 10 degree C water. Somewhat bracing.

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24101 by TaffyMick
No problems Gaz. Funnily I tipped out of the Comet for the first time today. Wasn't even paddling at the time, just putting my drink bottle under the bungie cord. Not quite sure what happened, but over I went....

Re-entering with mangrove mud all over your feet...what an enjoyable experience! Lol!

Stellar SEI, Fenn Bluefin S, Sladecraft Comet Long Rec & Vajda K1

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7 years 3 weeks ago #24104 by ShaneS
Replied by ShaneS on topic Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport
Seems the new Stellar SRs have quite a fan club :)

I joined this week too, a new SR Excel delivered on Monday and first run in a small surf at Currumbin today. Other than a few hours in a loaned ski and trying out some different brands this is my first ski after stepping from sea kayaks and SOTs.

A few swims out the back, including taking some dunkings and wondering why I was finding it hard to brace before realising my paddle feather angle had slipped during one of the spills ... :-/

I didn't spend a lot of hours in the V10-S, enough to get used to it but I liked the look and feel of the Stellar. I reckon I'll experiment with some padding though to lock myself in a little better.

Here's a little clip, noting that I had been doing some flat water work up the creek so only had one of the two venturi bungs out.


Have fun out there
Shane

Fenn Swordfish S Carbon Hybrid - 2016
Fenn Elite S Carbon - 2016
Stellar SR Excel - 2015
Cobra Expedition - 2013
The following user(s) said Thank You: red_pepper

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7 years 2 weeks ago #24108 by red_pepper
Thanks for the video clip; looks like you're having a blast!
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7 years 2 weeks ago #24114 by kobicohen33

ShaneS wrote: Seems the new Stellar SRs have quite a fan club :)

I joined this week too, a new SR Excel delivered on Monday and first run in a small surf at Currumbin today. Other than a few hours in a loaned ski and trying out some different brands this is my first ski after stepping from sea kayaks and SOTs.

A few swims out the back, including taking some dunkings and wondering why I was finding it hard to brace before realising my paddle feather angle had slipped during one of the spills ... :-/

I didn't spend a lot of hours in the V10-S, enough to get used to it but I liked the look and feel of the Stellar. I reckon I'll experiment with some padding though to lock myself in a little better.

Here's a little clip, noting that I had been doing some flat water work up the creek so only had one of the two venturi bungs out.



Have fun out there
Shane


Indeed, it looks fun!
But note that: your feet were in sea water all clip long and no emptying!
It does not happen V10,due to unique
Epic bailer draining your cockpit....

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7 years 2 weeks ago #24116 by red_pepper
He noted that he only had one of the two venturis unplugged; the new SR drains quite quickly with both open.
The following user(s) said Thank You: TaffyMick, ShaneS

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7 years 2 weeks ago #24120 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport
Yes quick seems to be a very relative term.

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7 years 2 weeks ago #24123 by Hammy
Replied by Hammy on topic Stellar SR vs Epic V10 Sport
Hello Paddlers. I have been following this thread with interest - thank you. I am interested in any further comments on new SR stability compared to V10S and Flow Superstar. Thanks for your input so far RedP and TaffyM. I am making transition from gr8 sea kayak to ocean ski. Have trialled Fenn XT, SEI, Horizon, old SR, and have spent 8-10 hours on V10 Sport and Flow Superstar. Very comfortable on last 2 except for dual action ocean chop. So...they are at the "limit" of stability for my needs (ocean fun and many klms flat). Old SR was OK too but I havent had long in it - bit of a barge in the cockpit. Many comments suggest the new SR is a contender too, but I am hesitant if its less stable than say V10Sport, since for me the Flow is more stable. Unfortunately it seems there is no-where to trial a new SR in Melb yet. Are the stability differences micro or noticeable? Thanks folks

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7 years 2 weeks ago - 7 years 2 weeks ago #24125 by TaffyMick
Hi Hammy,

Comparing the stability of a 2015 SR to a 2nd Gen Epic V10S is not as easy an answer as first seems because of a number of factors.

Firstly, the SR is shorter than the V10S which means it handles close chop and swell much better. The V10S handles big swells very well indeed.

Secondly the hull design is quite different, with the SR (as with all Stellars) using the swede style of hull, which retains the same width along a fair propotion of the length of the hull, whereas the V10S has most width from the bucket to just past the bungies at the rear of the seat.

Thirdly, it depends on what layup you have. The SR Excel layup appears to be the most popular for intermediate paddlers at around 11.5kg while the Advantage layup is around 14.5kg and is more suited to beginner/intermediate. In the Epic V10S range the Ultra layup (comparable to Excel) is 12.3kg, while the Performance (comparable to Advantage) is a hefty 16kg.

I had a V10S 2nd Gen in the Performance layup and found that it was a heavy beast to paddle without tide, wind and swell assistance. Get the right wind and swell conditions and it flew. The 2015 SR however handles all conditions with finesse and more. So much so that I got rid of my Stellar SEI and S18S as the SR meets all what I require in a ski for my paddling level.

To get back to the original question... stability? To me they are micro. Would not say that the new SR is more tippier than the V10S, but it is definitely more "twitchier" and marginally less stable than the previous model SR. But in saying that, you no longer have the feeling you are sitting in a barge. You feel as if you are comfortably "locked into" this ski. It is faster, picks up runs easier and stays on them longer due to the longer and higher volume bow deck and what I believe to be the most important and effective design alteration... moving the seat 3" forward.

Finally, the 2015 SR's secondary stability is still, in my opinion, best in class. Slightly less than the previous model, but I also believe this boat will more that hold its own among the range of intermediate boats in the hands of the right paddler.

Anyway Hammy, have rabbited on a fair bit. If most of your paddling is going to be within the Bay the SR will probably be the best all rounder. Particularly in that "dual action ocean chop" you speak of. But given the right conditions the V10S would also come into its own.

Good luck with your deliberations and give Gordon or Ian Clubb a call at Stellar Australia and see if they can put you onto someone local who has a 2015 SR you can test.

Cheers,

Mick

Stellar SEI, Fenn Bluefin S, Sladecraft Comet Long Rec & Vajda K1
Last edit: 7 years 2 weeks ago by TaffyMick.
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7 years 2 weeks ago #24126 by red_pepper
TaffyMick brings up a good point about the layups; a heavier boat is less reactive and feels - often substantially - more stable. I was playing with the math on this yesterday and it looks like you could decrease the reactivity by about 1/3 by going to the heavier layups (at roughly 1/3 heavier). Some of the Stellar boats also are designed with a touch less initial stability but with substantial secondary stability, giving a good combination of speed and stability but a little different feel than some other boats. One family I know bought the SR after buying a V10S, finding that the SR felt more stable to them. I was a bit surprised, since the V10S has a reputation for very good stability, but how a boat feels varies a lot by individual. Hopefully you can test them both out. I would probably go with either the Advantage Layup (Stellar) or Performance Layup (Epic) and you'll probably find either boat will be a lot of fun. As a side note, colored layups add roughly 1.2 - 1.8 lbs to the weight of a white boat (Stellar).

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