V10S Broken shaft housing

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9 years 4 months ago - 9 years 4 months ago #15060 by Alysum
Hello,

I recently purchased a V10S here in Sydney.

On my 3rd paddle I went over a submerged object a very low speed (actually resting) and there was a little bang on the rudder.

After the paddle about 1L of water leaked inside. I took the carbon rudder off (which has no damage at all and the shaft isn't bent or anything).
Closer inspection reveals the housing at the bottom is broken - the sort of round housing moves at the bottom so I guess that's where the leak is coming from.

I cannot believe despite a very strong rudder on an expensive fiberglass ski, the shaft housing would break so easily at the bottom?

I'm guessing it's very expensive and difficult to get it repaired? I should try and get in touch with Epic Australia and see about warranty. Sure it's personal damage but it's unacceptable for something to break so easily on the 3rd paddle. I have a few sail boats and they are designed with ultra strong rudder housings.

Attached is a picture, apologies for low quality.

I'd appreciate your thoughts and whether it's a regular occurrence with Epics.

Thanks,
Attachments:
Last edit: 9 years 4 months ago by Alysum.

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9 years 4 months ago #15066 by Kayaker Greg
The photo is not clear but I would say you might have to wear that one. Looks like the damage is pretty minor? If so I would put the housing tube into its correct position (already looks like it is so) and get some good quality two part epoxy from a marine store and you should be able to get some to run into the gap that has been created around the shaft for a very strong repair and have no further issues, as long as your more careful not to hit anything again. I would suggest West System G flex epoxy, I've used this on many kayaks and its very strong and durable. Clean the area thoroughly before using.

Disappointing with a new ski I know, but they are not designed to hit things and perhaps the ski should be stronger in that area, but your not going to change that and only you know how hard you actually hit anything. I've hit a few things hard enough to bend the rudder with ought damaging the housing in my SES, but I really think the repair looks and sounds easy to affect.

Good luck.

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9 years 4 months ago #15067 by Punches
Alysum,

I think you're on the right track to contact the dealer as it could be the bottom of the rudder tube perhaps wasn't bonded properly or sufficiently to the inside of the hull and Epic may help out with the repair. Epic rudders are fairly light weight and I and a couple of my mates have damaged more than a few of them very easily without any damage to the housing. An inspection of the inside of the hull may be the only way to confirm if the bond has failed. It's also the best way to get it fixed and you should do something about it sooner rather than later. It shouldn't be very expensive.

It's not an issue isolated to Epic by the way. Others report similar faults with other brands in the forum and varied responses from their dealers.

My ski, which is not an Epic, is leaking in this area and I recently fixed it by injecting resin with a syringe into the space around the tube from the outside. Perhaps "fixed" is too strong a word at the moment and I should say that I've temporarily made it watertight. :lol: It's out of warranty BTW. After the "fix" I did did the old "Shake n Bake" trick. A little bit of detergent and freshwater into the breather hole, shake the ski around as much as you can to loosen the salt off the inside, empty the water out and leave it to bake in the sun with the breather hole open to get it dry inside.

Good luck with Epic and let us know how you get on with them.

Currently own Fenn Elite S, Renegade Double
Previously owned Epic V8, Think Legend, Stellar SES

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9 years 4 months ago #15069 by partymarty
I'd be thinking along the lines of a manufacturing fault.

I've got a V10s and the other day hit a submerged tree ( I knew it was close, but not that close - damn you king tides for covering what is exposed 350 days a year) with my rudder with enough force to throw me off the ski. Upon remounting and paddling a few hundred metres away (the submerged tree is in the mouth of a creek with a well known large resident croc, not the place to fall off) I expected to find damage but only had a small chunk taken out of the rudder. The housing and shaft were fine. I was paddling at about 90%, so did hit it with some force.

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9 years 4 months ago - 9 years 4 months ago #15070 by Alysum
Thanks everyone for the responses.

I have contacted Epic Australia who is willing to get the ski inspected to determine whether it's a fault so that's a good start.

They mentioned that I must had read on the forums that the shafts/rudder that ripped apart but the housing fine, must have come from the older carbon shafts which were designed to break to protect the housing.
They also mentioned housing breakages are rare across Australia which makes me feel really unlucky?!

Can anyone confirm they've had an aluminium/titanium shaft/rudder broken off but the housing fine? Because this would get interesting.

I'm a complete beginner so wasn't paddling fast, I was actually resting - obviously I cannot prove this to Epic...

Thanks again
Last edit: 9 years 4 months ago by Alysum.

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9 years 2 months ago #15706 by Angry
Replied by Angry on topic Re: V10S Broken shaft housing
I have the 2006 Epic V10 Sport. When I bought it, the guy before had already repaired the hull around the rudder shaft because he hit something. His repairer cut a diamond shape section out about 20cm long and 10cm wide, and layed a patch on it/in it (I have no idea how to fibreglass/lay kevlar etc, so ask an expert how to do that).

But the point is, he hit something and it broke. Then he got an expert to fix it for about $250 and now it is strong as .

Last year I hit an oyster lease at about 11kmh (yes dumb, but I was racing and tired). The rudder shaft bent, which hampered my race, but the previous repair and strengthening meant that a bent rudder shaft was the only damage. It was also easy to straighten and get the foot pedals working again.

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9 years 2 months ago #15713 by Wally
Replied by Wally on topic Re: V10S Broken shaft housing
Guys, do your maths. Drive your car into a solid object at any speed and tell me if there is any damage!
You will be going at some speed whether fast or slow and obviously you dont weigh nothing, plus the weight of the ski, the inertia is quite a lot on a 10mm shaft.
I repair them all the time, name the brand, some worse than others, I can name the worst offenders and Epic is not the worst by far! it most often happens in the river where there are submerged objects and shallow water.

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9 years 2 months ago #15716 by fredrik
Wally´s point has some merit, but to compare to a car is not valid.

Drifting onto a rock is normally NO problem, at least for some brands. The tail will rise and/or slide to the side. Paddling onto a rock at slow speed 7-8 kph you may be lucky and just get a "sandable" dent in the carbon rudder.

At higher speeds you should expect some damage, but again you may be lucky with no damage.

I have hit an underwater rock at 12 kph with my "other brand" rudder, with just a small dent, so it is possible.

Thus, I belive it it too easy for the makers to lean back and solely blame the users if they hit something. As Epic obviously know that this is an issue, why don´t they just beef up the rudder area with a few grams of carbon/epoxy, so that the damage is transfered to the rudderpin (which can be bent back within minutes).

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9 years 2 months ago #15717 by AndyN
Replied by AndyN on topic Re: V10S Broken shaft housing
My V12 developed a leak around the rudder shaft after a couple of years of pretty solid use but NO incidents, I took it into a carbon specialist for repair here in Dubai and he was not very complimentary about the rudder tube contruction to say the least!!
However the repair is probably now the strongest part of the ski and its never leaked since.

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