If I capsize with stuck foot strap, do I remain submerged?

6 months 1 week ago #30990 by rickbinbc
I am going to go out on a limb here. It looks like only one person has really answered your question.

Here's my two cents worth - if you are on flat water and in a drysuit + PFD, I am willing to bet that 9 times out of 10 you won't even get your hair wet, let alone roll completely inverted, whether your feet get stuck or not. Because you are sitting ON and not IN the surfski (as opposed to a kayak), as you roll over your butt will fall out before the boat rolls on top of you. Likely you end up effectively lying on your side and the reflex is to keep your eyes level, so your head doesn't even touch the water in many cases, especially a slow "oops I'm falling" capsize.

I say this because my first surfski was a gen-1 V10 and I spent considerable time perfecting the "paddle two strokes, fall out, swim beside, get back in" manoeuvre.

Disclaimer - in waves and wind, this observation does not apply. I have had the ski roll completely over top of me on a number of occasions, usually because I have fallen out on the leeward side. Apparently I have been slow to learn the "lean into the wave" adage. So all the advice regarding how important it is to practice remounts is completely valid and important for when you decide to paddle more than a few metres from the safety of the shore. As someone on this thread mentioned swimming any distance is no fun, and in cold water potentially deadly. Far better to remount and carry on.

PS - enjoy your V7! I think that with your experience in kayaking, you will be surprised at the seeming contradiction of speed and stability.
The following user(s) said Thank You: SpaceSputnik

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago - 6 months 1 week ago #30991 by SpaceSputnik
Hey thanks a bunch!
I guess my question didn't quite make sense to surfskiers, but it would have made make sense to a kayaker, especially one who wet-exited in sub-10 C water in full winter gear.

Thanks again, can't wait..

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #30993 by Hiro
You will remain submerged... but only if your legs are 30cm long...

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #30994 by SpaceSputnik

Hiro wrote: You will remain submerged... but only if your legs are 30cm long...


That's hillarious :D

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31014 by manta
I have only been paddling a short while so hopefully my observations will help you.

The ski I bought was a Fenn Bluefinn due to its beginner friendly manners. I live by the sea so the very first day I suited up in my wetsuit with my PFD on and went into the bay and just practiced all the things you mention. I fell out on purpose keeping my feet in the straps to see what would happen. Essentially you just float next to the ski.

Then I practised remounts ala the Chalupsky method and made sure I could do it from either side. All this practice was very important. After a couple of months I felt ready to do a downwinder and so arranged with a group of paddlers to do one, letting them know I am a beginner etc. Well it was during the Millers run season so at the "start" of the run, everyone paddled away from me. It was my first run so inevitably I fell in. I fell in 5 times that day, all on my own in the middle of the ocean. The wind was at a good 25 knots and the waves were pretty big. The only thing that saved me was all the practice remounts I had done.

Near the end I was getting very tired and it took 3 tries to remount. Thankfully I got it on number 3 or I may have needed to be rescued (had all the rescue stuff with me including the NSRI app). It was a huge wake up call for me. Here are my lessons;
  1. Practice every eventuality and do it until it is muscle memory
  2. Don't paddle with people you don't know who will abandon you in a potentially dangerous situation
  3. Make sure you are able to do the distance you are planning even if you need to do some remounts as those take a lot of energy

I think that is it. I have now done quite a few downwinds I usually do them with the SUP people as they are more my speed and we can stick together better.

Enjoy the paddling I have found it to be a very rewarding sport.

M

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31015 by SpaceSputnik
Wonderful, thank you.
I will certainly practice remounts and I am not planning on surfing. I am well familiar with the area and it's mostly protected water. I also plan to have a DCS VHF radio on me at all times. Canada requires a license to carry one which I recently obtained by passing an exam.

Thanks again.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31023 by Fath2o
Sputnik, I'm curious. Does Canada have a system similar to the
"Rescue 21" system we have in the US?

wow.uscgaux.info/content.php?unit=170&ca...-vhf-radio-rescue-21

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31024 by SpaceSputnik

Fath2o wrote: Sputnik, I'm curious. Does Canada have a system similar to the
"Rescue 21" system we have in the US?

wow.uscgaux.info/content.php?unit=170&ca...-vhf-radio-rescue-21


If you are referring to DCS than yes, we have it and channel 70 is operational.
I thought it was a global thing.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31026 by Fath2o
Sputnik, reading your response concerns me that you may not fully understand how a DSC- "digital select calling" equipped VHF radio actually works. I would recommend you read the information provided with the link I posted. The rescue 21 system was created by the US govt. for use in US coastal waters. It is not a global system. A DSC emergency broadcast has no value if no one is monitoring and/or willing to respond.
I understand many mariners consider an incoming DSC alert to be a nuisance and will ignore transmission.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31027 by rickbinbc
If I'm not mistaken, you would need a portable VHF radio with GPS capability to use the DSC feature. Looks like they are available on Amazon for about $CDN 360.

I have an older Standard Horizon HX270S that would require me to use channel 16 (Canada International Distress Channel) and manually make the call.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31028 by SpaceSputnik
Don't worry, I do understand how DCS works. I sat a class with an exam at the end. The "global" entered the conversation because we were taught that DCS is a part of something called GDMSS which is said to be a "global" system. Areas A1 and A2 of this system are the areas of being within reach of one or more DCS (VHF or MF) monitoring shore stations. Canada and US (I am pretty sure) consistently implement the requirements of area A1, i.e. there is always someone monitoring the DCS distress calls within 20 nautical miles from shore + stations on nearby boats being extra help.
Having said that, a handheld radio won't reach anywhere that far and is basically line-of-sight. But channel 70 is digitally monitored by coast guard, police and such in my target area for 100% sure. Provided your signal can reach them.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31029 by SpaceSputnik

rickbinbc wrote: If I'm not mistaken, you would need a portable VHF radio with GPS capability to use the DSC feature. Looks like they are available on Amazon for about $CDN 360.

I have an older Standard Horizon HX270S that would require me to use channel 16 (Canada International Distress Channel) and manually make the call.


Yes, for around that much I can easily get a proper class D DCS VHF handheld marine unit, obtain an mmsi and use it as expected.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31030 by tve
FWIW I went through the "what radio do I buy" stuff a month ago and ended up with the HX870 and so far am very happy. I carry it in the front pocket of my mocke PFD and it has not disturbed me when remounting even though it's rather thick. I did make several DSC test calls to verify that the CG can receive my transmission. My recommendation would be that if you go out alone to get a DSC radio, else stick with a simpler, cheaper, smaller radio.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31032 by Fath2o
Just to clarify. The USCG high sights ie; Rescue 21 system,
can receive an analog 1 watt transmission from a handheld vhf radio up to 20 miles offshore as well as a digital DSC (not dcs) digital transmission on channel 70. The range of a transmission signal, digital or analog, to another vessel or shore station is limited by line of sight and transmission wattage of radio.
(BTW, I am a USCG licensed passenger vessel Captain.)
Anyway, sounds like Canada has a similar monitoring system as US picking up signals up to 20 miles offshore.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31033 by SpaceSputnik
I have not heard of anything similar to Rescue 21 in Canada which seems longer range than regular VHF/DSC.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago - 6 months 1 week ago #31034 by SpaceSputnik

tve wrote: FWIW I went through the "what radio do I buy" stuff a month ago and ended up with the HX870 and so far am very happy. I carry it in the front pocket of my mocke PFD and it has not disturbed me when remounting even though it's rather thick. I did make several DSC test calls to verify that the CG can receive my transmission. My recommendation would be that if you go out alone to get a DSC radio, else stick with a simpler, cheaper, smaller radio.


Can you elaborate on how you did DSC test calls to CG? Did you do a non-distress DSC call to an MMSI that was somehow known to belong to a CG station? We were specifically told not to make test mayday calls as it is basically illegal.

Also, have you considered this Cobra radio by any chance: www.cobra.com/products/handheld/mr-hh600w
Compared to the Standard Horizon you have it can repeat the last 20 seconds of the latest received message as well as can be paired to a phone as a headset. Being able to call 911 in addition to distress calling seems like a good thing.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago #31035 by tve
"Did you do a non-distress DSC call to an MMSI that was somehow known to belong to a CG station" - yes, the CG publishes a test mmsi

The reviews I saw about the cobra were very poor in the durability & water proofing aspects IIRC. I lost confidence. The bluetooth features did look interesting.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

6 months 1 week ago - 6 months 1 week ago #31036 by SpaceSputnik
This is very useful, thank you.
I will stick with HX870.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Latest Forum Topics

firtree's Avatar

Paddle grabbing enough? (6 Posts)

1 hour 54 minutes ago
SurfskiEstonia's Avatar

Looking for a new GPS (5 Posts)

13 hours 30 minutes ago
nell's Avatar

Wing Paddle Recommendations? (6 Posts)

20 hours 54 minutes ago
Protected by R Antispam