[help] leaking seam

3 years 5 months ago #28773 by matteo
[help] leaking seam was created by matteo
Hello,
I bought a second hand Epic v10 Sport 2 weeks ago, but already it has problems. It's leaking because the taped seam has some cracks. Looks like it's has already been badly repaired with a tape and repainted without even sandpaper it. Rusty water is leaking. There are no shop for repair composite kayak in my area so I have taken it to a boat repair shop. Clearly they never have seen a surfsky before (me too), but they proposed to remove completely the seam and replace it.
Well, I no have idea if it's a easy or impossible work, I am a bit scared because they are used to work on much ticker hulls.
I would like to have your opinion
Thank you.

I know I look like a dumb, but I wished so much to have a surfski that I didn't checked too much (at all) when I bought it
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3 years 5 months ago #28774 by Paul600
Replied by Paul600 on topic [help] leaking seam
I'm sure Ranga will be along to give you the definitive answer but I'd have thought that if it's leaking through the seams at multiple points around the ski then replacing the seam (after repairing any more significant damage underneath) would be the way to go. That's not a difficult job for any competent boat repairer.

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3 years 5 months ago #28775 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic [help] leaking seam
I would never take the whole seam off. There are just a few places with the problem, why would you remove it all?
Just sand off the damaged areas till you get back to the hull and deck surfaces and replace with fiberglass tape and resin. A very simple job.

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3 years 5 months ago #28779 by BustedRudder
Replied by BustedRudder on topic [help] leaking seam
Does that "tape" go all the way around the boat or limited to a few areas? That will decide how large a job...

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3 years 5 months ago #28780 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic [help] leaking seam
The whole seam is taped but you only have a small area that needs re-fixing.

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3 years 5 months ago #28781 by matteo
Replied by matteo on topic [help] leaking seam
thank you for your answers.
Yes the whole seam is taped and it's leaking just in a few places, but when I bought it was perfect. All this disaster happened just in a few times in water so I think things can go much worse after some more use.
You reassured me about the relative easiness of this work and I think it's a good idea to take the whole seam off and separate hull and deck to check what is so rusty inside and reinforce the anchor points or the rudder pedals.

In the 2 images attached you can see how the paint over the seal is flaking


and the seal itself is slightly detached. Rust is leaking from there too.
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3 years 5 months ago #28782 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic [help] leaking seam
I do this for a living and if you want to remove the whole seam you would make someone rich for no reason. You cannot take the deck off from the hull without serious damage to the ski and a lot of cost. In fact more than what you paid for it in the first place, even if you bought it new.
As I have stated before the patches were poorly done, redo them only, the rusty colour is the water coming from the outside, not inside, there is nothing in the ski that would cause the dark colour water.
I doubt the ski even takes on water from pictures I can see. Does water run out of those areas?
One easy way to check is to put a 2 litres of water in the ski and see where it comes out, just swish it around and check where the water is running out.
Unless you paddle with the seam under water there should be no water coming in as the seam is above the water, paddling on flat water that is.
There are other possible areas where water is coming in like the rudder post and the ventury.

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3 years 5 months ago #28783 by matteo
Replied by matteo on topic [help] leaking seam
hi Ranga
yes water is going out from those cracks, here the boat stand on one side, a drop is leaking

and the rust is coming from the ski, I removed the screws, they were rusty. Every time there is water inside, maybe yes is coming from the rudder or the venturi. I paddle at sea, so the seam is often underwater, but me too I don't think water could enter from those cracks.

I want to cry

So, what I can do is
sand off the damaged areas till you get back to the hull and deck surfaces and replace with fiberglass tape and resin
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3 years 5 months ago #28784 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic [help] leaking seam
Yes, but another way to get the old stuff off is with a chisel, but be careful and only remove the damaged area. Put the chisel on the hull and push it under the seam, it will go under the seam and it will lift off.
Once the seam is off make sure you dry the ski and drain all the water out, that might have been the problem with the original repair, water and composites don`t mix when surfaces are damp.
A good tip is to mask up either side of the seam before you do any work to protect the hull and deck from scratches from sanding.
The boat builder should have no problem with these repairs, you don`t need a ski repairer, they are all boat builders to start with anyway.
I use epoxy resin for all my repairs, it is much stronger and bonds much better to any composite surface.

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3 years 5 months ago #28787 by matteo
Replied by matteo on topic [help] leaking seam
Thank you very much for your help, I will show the wip here

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3 years 4 months ago - 3 years 4 months ago #28948 by matteo
Replied by matteo on topic [help] leaking seam

Ranga wrote: Yes, but another way to get the old stuff off is with a chisel, but be careful and only remove the damaged area. Put the chisel on the hull and push it under the seam, it will go under the seam and it will lift off.
Once the seam is off make sure you dry the ski and drain all the water out, that might have been the problem with the original repair, water and composites don`t mix when surfaces are damp.
A good tip is to mask up either side of the seam before you do any work to protect the hull and deck from scratches from sanding.
The boat builder should have no problem with these repairs, you don`t need a ski repairer, they are all boat builders to start with anyway.
I use epoxy resin for all my repairs, it is much stronger and bonds much better to any composite surface.



hi, next Monday they will start to work at it, meanwhile we have started to check the seam. the previous repair turned out to be just a 1 cm wide fabric tape, like a plaster, covered by gelcoat. the gelcoat was applied without sanding, I can easily take it out with my nails


I was surprised to see the gap between hull and deck, it's 2-3 mm , it's normal?


Monday they start to sand and apply a fiberglass seam, 2-3 meter at a time.

the removed 1cm plaster


2-3mm gap


while staying in the shipyard many small bubbles (1mm diameter) appeared on the foredeck, I suppose they worked with a spray solvent nearby

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3 years 4 months ago #28953 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic [help] leaking seam
You must remove all the old patches, should come off easily if you say there is no sanding. Save a lot of extra work.

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3 years 4 months ago #29008 by matteo
Replied by matteo on topic [help] leaking seam
hi Ranga
They have made the work: Removed all the old patches, filled the gap between hull and deck with epoxy, then a fiberglass seal , finish with gelcoat on the new seal.
The work is not bad, just the bill is impressive in my opinion: 800 euro.
If I can ask an opinion about this bill, isn't it too high?
Thanks

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3 years 4 months ago #29009 by Ranga
Replied by Ranga on topic [help] leaking seam
There are a lot of variables to patching around the world.
You did not say where you are and in the developed areas of Europe it can get very expensive. They are not a small craft specialist so I suspect their cost structure is quite high due to things like high rent for a large site as they do large boats, even though your ski is very small it will incur the same cost as a large one.
It is a fiddly job for them and it all takes time. If the job is good quality then it is acceptable but on the high side. If I were to do it, it would be cheaper but I have a small workshop with low overheads and I specialise in skis.
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